LJ Reds and almost Ling 8/12

[ultimatejay]

Originally Posted by The pelican

It sounds like you're mistaken but I'd recommend doing whatever you think works best for you and gives you the most confidence on the water. A 4 yellowtail day is a great day at La Jolla but there are many people on this forum who've had many days like that or better. It can take a long time to draw conclusions about what works and what doesn't. Be careful about reading too much into one day on the water.

I fish braid to flouro near kelp and have caught plenty of yellowtail and not found them to be turned off by the braided line that consistently allows me to cut fish out of the kelp. Braided line also lets me feel the bait much better. I can sense when it's nervous and know a few seconds before I get bit (more often than not). Those are two big advantages when it comes to hooking and landing these fish.

In the wintertime mono works great in open water when dropping irons, for example. You can pull way harder, don't need to cut kelp, and don't need to feel a bait swimming.

I'm not trying to be a jerk but there are a lot of factors that could account for the reason you caught fish and your buddy didn't on one day. The first thing that comes to mind is luck. What are the chances that a coin toss comes up either heads 4 times in a row or tails 4 times in a row? It's 1 in 8 that you or your friend would have caught all 4 of the fish on that day. Your sample size is so small that even if you're right about the exact same presentation, it's not smart to come to any conclusion.

It's also possible that you think your presentation was the same as your friend's but it wasn't. The really successful guys on the water do many small things that might not be noticeable to most of us. Those small things add up to a big advantage.

A friend and I fished a kelp about 10 miles off LJ on my boat a couple weeks ago. We used the exact same set-up and bait. I caught 3 dorado and he caught none. I only tell this story to (a) brag on a kayak site that I have a boat, (b) rub it in your face that there are quality dorado just outside of kayak range, (c) find an excuse to tell you about fish I've caught and (d) to immediately contradict my coin toss example and tell everyone on the site that I have more skill than my friend who used the EXACT SAME SETUP and caught nothing.

It sounds like you had a great day at La Jolla and maybe you're reading into it a bit much. Just trying to be helpful and steer the OP away from what I consider misguided advice. If the guy finally puts the pieces together and gets slammed by that yellowtail he's been targeting, but loses it in the kelp, he's going to be rightfully bummed.

I won't beat a dead horse any longer.

I'm just giving my experience, I have seen fish that wouldn't bite 25-30lb line but if you went down to 15-20lb you would get bite after bite. Fish have great eye seight. Also, feeling your bait get excited is not going to change the outcome. Either you get bit or you dont how is that going to help you get hooked up? lol The only one advantage you have is with the kelp and that's it.

[tim506]

loved this thread,thank you all for the lesson

[The pelican]

Originally Posted by ultimatejay

I'm just giving my experience, I have seen fish that wouldn't bite 25-30lb line but if you went down to 15-20lb you would get bite after bite. Fish have great eye seight. Also, feeling your bait get excited is not going to change the outcome. Either you get bit or you dont how is that going to help you get hooked up? lol The only one advantage you have is with the kelp and that's it.

You're a few steps behind and just don't realize it. No more free help from me.

You want to bring 15 lb for all those days when you've seen LJ yellows afraid bite 25 lb? Be my guest.

You haven't learned why it's important to have a good feel for your bait when flylining? Spend some time on the water and figure it out. Or just throw it in the rod holder and take a nap. Whatever works for you, buddy.

[ultimatejay]

Originally Posted by The pelican

You're a few steps behind and just don't realize it. No more free help from me.

You want to bring 15 lb for all those days when you've seen LJ yellows afraid bite 25 lb? Be my guest.

You haven't learned why it's important to have a good feel for your bait when flylining? Spend some time on the water and figure it out. Or just throw it in the rod holder and take a nap. Whatever works for you, buddy.

Give me an example how knowing that your bait is getting excited is going to help you get hooked up? Either they fish grabs it or doesn't right? It could be getting excited by seeing a sea dog, other mackeral, any number of things. I don't see how that is going to effect the outcome but whatever works for you bud. 😉

[The pelican]

Originally Posted by ultimatejay

Give me an example how knowing that your bait is getting excited is going to help you get hooked up? Either they fish grabs it or doesn't right? It could be getting excited by seeing a sea dog, other mackeral, any number of things. I don't see how that is going to effect the outcome but whatever works for you bud. 😉

Wrong! Like I said, no more free help.

[ultimatejay]

Originally Posted by The pelican

Wrong! Like I said, no more free help.

Thanks I need the help 😂😂😂
My 10 year old son catches more fish than you

[ultimatejay]

😉😉😉😉😉😉

[greenscales]

To the Pelican - Don't stop giving advice just because one person has an attitude. Others who keep quiet are listening, hopefully including the original poster on this thread. Just don't be quite so sarcastic to those who can't handle constructive advice and just ignore them. Not worth typing the extra characters.

As for Ultimatejay - "Thanks I need the help 😂😂😂
My 10 year old son catches more fish than you."

Real Mature - it's like listening to a hipster Bernie supporter talk to reactionary Trump fan - or vice-versa. No one wants to give you help since evidently your anecdotal evidence is all you need. His response was for the original poster so he could offer a different perspective than you did (a more accurate one at that).

I don't post or read the forums much anymore because frankly I don't like to fish in the zoos or elsewhere when a bite is announced, preferring to go to Baja and I no longer want to share too much about those spots. I've been kayak fishing for over 20 years and mostly was in LJ - was in the sport fishing business for 10 years prior to even getting into the Yak. There were so few of us then kayak fishing LJ that I would get lit up by Coast Guard and Police Helos to check on my safety when fishing WSB at night. They scattered the bait and blew the bite when they would turn the spot on me. For my 'bonafides' - I was the rep who brought fluoro (Seguar) and Spectra (Power Pro) aggressively into the kayak market - sponsored Spike among others. I have posted similar explanations before in the distant past, but I guess it's time again. And I am no longer associated with any product in the fishing business - so I have no invested interest in my comments, just hoping to educate others.

The Pelican is right and you are scientifically wrong about mono vs. spectra w/fluoro top shot, specifically regarding visibility. Fluoro gets bit over mono for a simple reason, it doesn't reflect and refract light like mono - some mono almost looks like an LED in certain light/water conditions. If you are using poorer quality or fluoro blended lines, that may not be as true. Spectra is opaque, not allowing any light to travel down and is usually less visible than the best mono looking from below. This is the main reason fluoro was invented - as a high density, ultra-clear, non-reflective coating for certain aircraft equipment that needed to be distortion free. They then discovered its application as a fishing line. Fluoro should also be much closer to the density of water and spectras are so much thinner than mono that the bait also acts more naturally since there is less drag. An as eluded to, the lack of stretch in Spectra does provide better sensitivity.

However, there can exist water conditions where the mono is nearly as invisible as fluoro and it's larger diameter and stretchiness might just sync up to provide a better overall presentation on a specific day. That could have been the case on the day you cited. I often like how a 6X JR sinks slower in lighter currents with the extra drag from mono, vs the faster sink rate w/Spectra. Mono is also easier to cast for some - specially w/older gear. The reason the Tranx was created was for Shimano to make it easier to cast a Surface Iron using Power Pro once they bought the company. The biggest reasons for the original resistance to Spectra w/short fluoro was the tendency for Spectra to cut off others on sport boats and fish to come unbuttoned or break off the leader when they were at shallow color. The later caused fishing equipment and techniques that didn't match - stronger drags on high speed reels, ex-fast graphite rods, and no stretch Spectra combined to eliminate any forgiveness. If a fish took a run as a swell lifted a boat - plus the anglers adrenaline kicks in at the end of the fight - 10 ft. of line would get pulled to 20 ft, and 20lbs of tension turned to 40lbs. in a few seconds - and something would have to give - usually one of the knots. But those issue don't exist on the kayak. You almost never here a talented/experienced skipper or crew claim that mono is as good or better than fluoro for visibility - but exactly the opposite.

My biggest issue w/Spectra on the yak is when using heavy Spectra and Fluoro and fishing bottom structure, if you get stuck deep, the yak just doesn't provide enough leverage to pop it free - and 100+ feet of Spectra is not something you want to leave in the ocean.